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samAdhAna- ... gnAt ho jAy to dravya, kShetra, kAl, bhAv yogya lage to kahe, anyathA nahIn bhI kahe. svayam samajh le.

mumukShu- gnAnI kahate hI nahIn hai na. gnAnion kahate nahIn hai.

samAdhAna- jisamen lAbh dikhe usamen kahe, na dikhe (to nahIn kahe). .. to kuchh kahe bhI, prasang na dikhe to na kahe. puNyakI kachAs kaho, jo bhI kaho, karanA svayamko hai. vah mAlUm paDe yA na paDe, svayamko to svayamkI taiyArI karanI hai. mAlUm paDe to bhI svayamko puruShArtha-se karanA hai. mAlUm paDe to bhI svayamko puruShArtha karanA hai aur na mAlUm paDe to bhI svayamko puruShArtha karanA hai.

mumukShu- usamen thoDA jor Aye.

samAdhAna- to bhI puruShArtha to svayamko karanA hai. mAlUm paDe to baiThe nahIn rahanA hai. puruShArtha to svayamko hI karanA hai. puruShArtha karanekA hai, aisA koI kahe to bhI bhale aur us vakta ... bAkI puruShArtha to svayamko karanA hai.

mumukShu- ..

samAdhAna- .. sabake liye sugam panth taiyAr kar diyA hai. us panth par chalane- se sab mokShapurImen jA sake, aisA panth sabako prakAshit kar diyA hai, aisA panth gurudevane batA diyA hai. us panth par jAne-se sab mokShapurImen jA sakate hain. tabiyat aisI hai, lekin sab mandirake darshan.. gurudev virAjate the, vah bAt alag thI.

mumukShu- pUjya mAtAjI! hamAre prashna to vahI hain, parantu Ap jab uttar dete ho tab hamen vah sab uttar naye-naye lagate hain. hamArA yah prashna hai ki AbAlagopAl sarvako sadA kAl svayam hI svayamko anubhavamen A rahA hai, aisA samayasArakI 17-18 gAthAkI TIkAmen AchAryadev kahate hain. vahAn AchAryadevakA Ashay kyA hai? vahAn gnAnakA svaparaprakAshak svabhAv batAnA chAhate hain yA shiShyakI jo dRuShTikI bhUl hai, vah samajhAnA chAhate hain?

samAdhAna- usamen to dRuShTikI bhUl kahate hain. AbAlagopAlako anubhavamen A rahA hai, usakA artha aisA nahIn hai ki vah anubhUti, use AnandakI anubhUti ho rahI hai, aisA usakA artha nahIn hai. usakA artha aisA hai ki AtmA svayam astitva rUp-se,

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apanA gnAyakakA astitva chhoDA nahIn hai aur gnAyak gnAyakarUp pariNamatA hai. lekin use usakA gnAn aur shraddhAn nahIn hai. usakI dRuShTi bAhar hai.

vah aisA hai ki, jaise jaD apane svarUpako chhoDatA nahIn hai, vaise chaitanya apane svarUpako chhoDatA nahIn hai. svayam anubhUtisvarUp hI hai. gnAn asAdhAraN lakShaN hai ki gnAn gnAnasvarUp svayam pariNamatA hai. lekin use usakI anubhUti nahIn hai. anubhUti arthAt use AnandakI anubhUti nahIn hai. parantu svayam apane anubhUtisvarUp arthAt chaitanya chaitanyarUp pariNamatA hai. arthAt gnAn gnAnarUp-se anubhavamen A rahA hai. lekin usako svayamko vah mAlUm nahIn hai ki main chaitanya svayam astitva svarUp hUn. usakA astitva usane grahaN nahIn kiyA hai, lekin astitvakA nAsh nahIn huA hai. vah anubhUtisvarUp hI hai. AtmA svayam anubhUtisvarUp hai. lekin us anubhUtikA svayamne anubhav nahIn kiyA hai. aisA usakA artha hai.

mumukShu- dRuShTikI bhUl hai, yah batAnA hai.

samAdhAna- dRuShTikI bhUl hai, yah batAnA hai. usakI dRuShTikI bhUl hai. usakI dRuShTi bAhar hai. jaise dUsaronkI ginatI karatA hai ki yah AdamI hai, yah AdamI hai, lekin svayamko ginanA bhUl jAtA hai. aise svayam sab bAhar dekh rahA hai. bAharakA hai, lekin main svayam chaitanya hUn, usake astitvakA nAsh nahIn huA hai, lekin vah svayamko bhUl gayA hai. apanA astitva anubhavamen A rahA hai. parantu us astitvakI AnandakI anubhUti nahIn hai.

anubhUtisvarUp svayam hone par bhI use AnandakI anubhUti nahIn hai. gnAn asAdhAraN lakShaN hai ki jis lakShaN-se svayam apaneko pahachAn sake aisA hai. vah gnAn-gnAyakatAkA nAsh nahIn huA hai, gnAn gnAnarUp pariNamatA hai. lekin svayam us gnAyakatArUp nahIn huA hai. isaliye usakI or dRuShTi kare, usakA gnAn kare, usakA AcharaN kare to use AnandakI anubhUti pragaT hotI hai. usakI shraddhA nahIn karatA hai, svayam svayamkA yathArtha gnAn nahIn karatA hai.

yadi pratIti nishank ho to usakA AcharaNakA bal bhI baDh jAtA hai. to usakA AcharaN bhI joradAr apanI or hotA hai. lekin nishankatA nahIn hai. dRuShTi bAhar hai, isaliye svayam svayamko bhUl gayA hai. dekhe to gnAn asAdhAraN lakShaN hai. usakA nAsh nahIn huA hai. to bhI svayam svayamko dekhatA nahIn. vah anubhUtisvarUp bhagavAn AtmAkA svayam AnandarUp anubhav nahIn karatA hai. ata anubhavamen to A rahA hai, parantu vah AnandarUp anubhavamen nahIn A rahA hai. gnAn gnAnarUp, usakA astitva astitvarUp pariNamatA hai. aisA usakA artha hai.

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mumukShu- matalab vahAn astitva .. kahanA hai aur apanA dhyAn nahIn rahatA hai aur apanA AnandakA anubhav nahIn kar rahA hai, aisA hI na?

samAdhAna- AnandakI anubhUti nahIn hai. vahAn anubhavakA artha aisA nahIn hai ki use svAnubhav hai. aisA artha nahIn hai. svayam apane svabhAvarUp pariNamatA hai. bas! aisA usakA artha hai. AnandakI anubhUtikA artha nahIn hai. gnAnakA nAsh nahIn huA hai, parantu gnAn gnAnarUp pariNamatA hai. usakA astitva astitvarUp hai. parantu us astitvakI use pratIti nahIn hai. astitva gnAn gnAnarUp hai, parantu us astitvakI use svayamko pratIti nahIn hai. apanI taraph yadi lakShya kare to svayamko astitva grahaN ho aisA hai. gnAn gnAnarUp pariNamatA hai, lekin vah dekhatA nahIn hai. usakA svabhAv hI anubhUtisvarUp hai. vah svayam vedanasvarUp AtmA hai. parantu use vah pragaTarUpase vedatA nahIn hai.

mumukShu- vahAn to pratham AtmAko jAnanA aisA kahA hai, shraddhAn bAdamen, aisA liyA hai.

samAdhAna- jab vah svayam apanI taraph jAy (usamen) pahale svayamko gnAn-se pahachAne. vastu svarUp-se use pratIt yathArtha nahIn hai. pahale gnAn yathArtha karanA, phir pratIt karanI, phir AcharaN karanA, kram aisA liyA hai. anAdi-se svayamko sachchI samajh hI nahIn hai. isaliye vyavahAramen aisA kahe ki svayamne apanA gnAn yathArtha nahIn kiyA hai, isaliye tU yathArtha kar to shraddhA yathArtha hogI, aisA kahanemen AtA hai.

bAkI vAstavamen samyagdarshan, gnAn, chAritrANI mokShamArga (hai). yathArtha pratIt ho to hI mokShamArgakA prArambh hotA hai. lekin use pahale gnAn karanA chAhiye. usake mArgamen aisA AtA hai ki tU yathArtha gnAn kar, phir shraddhA hotI hai. isaliye pratham gnAn karanekA AtA hai. anAdikA anajAnA..

mumukShu- usakA artha yah hai ki pratham shraddhA karanI to hI gnAn huA aisA kahanemen Aye.

samAdhAna- hAn, shraddhA yathArtha ho to hI yathArtha gnAn hotA hai. parantu pratham samajh jUThI hai, isaliye pratham samajhan yathArtha kara. vyavahAr-se aisA AtA hai. kathan aisA hai ki vyavahAramen pahale gnAn yathArtha kara. sirpha kathan hai aisA nahIn, pahale use jAnanekA bIchamen AtA hai. pratIti bAdamen yathArtha hotI hai. gnAn yathArtha na ho to pratIti yathArtha nahIn hotI hai. parantu pratIti yathArtha ho to hI gnAnako yathArtha kahanemen AtA hai. nishchay dRuShTi-se aisA hai.

mumukShu- do bAt AtI hai.

samAdhAna- do bAt hai, do bAt aisI hai.

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mumukShu- do bAtamen hamen gaDabaD bahut hotI hai. ek kah to hamen ThIk rahatA hai. shraddhA karanI hai to shraddhA par jor den.

samAdhAna- sachchI samajh binA shraddhA yathArtha hotI nahIn aur yathArtha shraddhA binA gnAn yathArtha hotA nahIn.

mumukShu- donon sanlagna hai aise lenA?

samAdhAna- donon sAthamen sanlagna hai.

mumukShu- to hamen gnAn bhI karanA aur shraddhA bhI karanI.

samAdhAna- gnAn aur shraddhA donon sAth hI hai. yathArtha shraddhA ho use yathArtha gnAn hue binA rahatA nahIn aur jise yathArtha gnAn ho use shraddhA yathArtha hotI hI hai.

mumukShu- pAtra shiShya samyagdarshan prApta karane hetu kaisA chintavan, manan kare ki jisase use prayojanakI shIghra siddhi ho? chintavan, manan kaisA honA chAhiye?

samAdhAna- nirantar gnAyakakA chintavan honA chAhiye ki mujhe gnAyak hI chAhiye, dUsarA kuchh nahIn chAhiye. sab shubhAshubh bhAv jo vibhAvabhAv hai, vibhAvabhAvamen jise shAnti nahIn lagatI, merA svabhAv gnAyak svarUp AtmA hI sukharUp aur AnandarUp hai. usakA chintavan, usakA manan, usake liye use bArambAr usIkA abhyAs, us jAtake shrutakA chintavan, dravya-guN-paryAy, AtmAkA dravya kyA? guN kyA? aur paryAy kyA? us jAtakA chintavan, manan (chalanA chAhiye). anek prakAr-se jo prayojanabhUt tattva hai, usake vichAr, nimitta-upAdAn Adi anek prakAr-se us taraphakA chintavan manan hotA hai.

main gnAyak hUn, parapadArthakA kartA nahIn hUn, pratyek dravya svatantra hain, anek jAtakA chintavan (chale). lekin (vah sab) ek gnAyakakI siddhike liye (hotA hai). merA gnAyak chaitanyatattva, gnAyak gnAyakarUp kaise pariName, aisI bhAvanA use nirantar hotI hai. chintavan, manan bArambAr usIkA hotA hai. kShaN-kShaNamen usakA chintavan, manan kaise rahe, aisA usakA prayatna hotA hai. usamen vah thakatA nahIn hai. bArambAr usIkA chintavan, manan hotA hai.

mumukShu- main ek gnAyak hUn, aisA hamen bArambAr vichAr karanA?

samAdhAna- vichAranA nahIn, gnAyakakA svabhAv pahachAnakar vichAr karanA. aise raTanamAtra- se nahIn hotA. parantu antaramen svabhAvako grahaN karane-se hotA hai. pragnA-se bhinna kiyA, pragnA-se grahaN kiyA. antaramen-se grahaN karane-se usakI sUkShma sandhimen-se chaitanyako bhinna karanekA bArambAr prayatna kare to vah bhinna paD jAtA hai. usakI pragnAchhainI-se bhinna paDatA hai. bArambAr usIkA prayatna kare. usakI pUrI dishA badal jAy, gnAyak taraph (ho jAtI hai). jo dRuShTi bAhar jAtI thI, us dRuShTiko bArambar gnAyak taraph, gnAyak or hI usakI

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pariNati bArambAr muDatI rahe, abhyAs rUp-se, yathArtha to bAdamen hotA hai.

mumukShu- pratyek vichArakA bahAv gnAyak-or hI hotA hai.

samAdhAna- gnAyak taraphakA hI hotA hai. gnAyakakI siddhi kaise ho? gnAyakakI prasiddhi kaise ho? us or hI (prayatna rahatA hai).

mumukShu- pragnAchhainI arthAt bhedagnAn karanA?

samAdhAna- hAn. bhedagnAn karanA. pragnA-se chaitanyako grahaN karanA aur pragnA-se bhinna karanA. vibhAv-se bhinna aur svabhAvakA grahaN karanA. ekatva aur vibhakta. par- se vibhakta, vibhAv-se vibhakta aur svabhAvamen ekatva.

mumukShu- par-se vibhakta aisA chintavan kare to bhI usakA sva taraph jAnekA prayatna hai.

samAdhAna- par-se vibhakta chintavan kare, yathArthapane vibhakta chintave to usamen svakI ekatvatA A jAtI hai. lekin sva-taraphakA, astitva taraphake grahaNakA lakShya nahIn hai, aur bAhar yah sab anitya hai, yah sab dukharUp hai, aisA karatA rahe (aur) apane astitvakA grahaN nahIn hai to vah vibhaktapanA bhI yathArtha nahIn hai. ekatva astitva grahaN kiye binAkA vibhaktapanA yathArtha nahIn hai.

mumukShu- ekatva-vibhakta kahanemen AtA hai, lekin shurUAt ekatva-se hI hotI hai.

samAdhAna- shurUAt ekatva-se hI hotI hai.

mumukShu- usamen vibhakta A jAtA hai.

samAdhAna- usamen vibhakta A jAtA hai.

mumukShu- ek dravya-se dUsare dravyakI bhinnatA, ye to gurudevake aur Apake pratAp- se thoDA-thoDA mumukShuonko khyAlamen AtA hai ki yah dravya bhinna aur yah dravya bhinna hai. parantu dravya-guN aur paryAy, usamen kis prakAr bhinnatA karake anubhav karanA, is viShayamen hamen mArgadarshan dIjiye.

samAdhAna- ek dravya aur dUsarA dravya atyant bhinna hain, unhen pradeshabhed hai. vah to bhinna hai. vibhAv apanA svabhAv nahIn hai. shAstramen bhedagnAn karanekA AtA hai, vibhAv- se vibhakta ho. guN-paryAyase bhedagnAn karanekA nahIn AtA hai. bhedagnAn to vibhAv-se karanA hai. guN aur paryAyake lakShaN pahachAnakar aur AtmAmen ananta guN aur paryAy kyA hai, usakA gnAn karake, usake bhedamen aTakanA nahIn. usake bhed vikalpamen nahIn rukakar, ek akhaNDa chaitanya par dRuShTi rakhane-se usamen jo usake ananta guN aur shuddha paryAy hai, vah pragaT hotI hai.

usakA-guN-paryAyakA-bhedagnAn nahIn karanA hai, apitu usakA gnAn karanA hai ki ananta guN AtmAmen (hain). AtmA ananta guNon-se gunthA huA abhed tattva hai. usamen

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ananta guN kis tarah hai? gnAnakA gnAn lakShaN, AnandakA Ananda lakShaN, chAritra chAritrarUp hai, (gnAn) jAnanekA kArya kare, Ananda AnandakA kArya kare. usake kArya par-se, usake lakShaN par-se pahachAn sakatA hai. use pahachAnakar guNabhedamen rukanA vah to vikalpa aur rAgamishrit hai. vah to bIchamen Aye rahatA nahIn. isaliye ek chaitanya par akhaNDa dRuShTi karake aur us dRuShTimen svayam sthir ho to usamen-se use svAnubhUti pragaT hotI hai. vikalpa TUTakar main nirvikalpa tattva hUn, aise sAmAnya astitva par, nij gnAyakake astitva par dRuShTiko nishank karake usamen yadi sthiratA, lInatA, AcharaN kare to svAnubhUti hotI hai.

do dravya bhinna hain, ye to dikhatA hai. parantu bhedagnAn to vibhAv-se karanA hai. ye to gnAn karanA hai. AtmA ananta-ananta shaktion-se bharapUr, ananta dravya usake pAs Aye to bhI apanA astitva rakhatA hai, aisI ananta shakti hai. isase atirikta usamen ananta guN hai, ananta dharma hain, un sabakA gnAn karaneke liye, usakA lakShaN aur kArya par-se pahachAn sakatA hai. phir usake bhed vikalpamen rukanA nahIn hai. vah guN to apanA svarUp hai. apane svarUpase guN bhinna nahIn hai. isaliye usakA gnAn karake, guNabhedamen nahIn rukakar, paryAyabhedamen nahIn rukakar svayam nij chaitanya par dRuShTi rakhe. mAtra jAn le ki yah guN hai, yah paryAy hai. guNabhedamen rukanekA koI prayojan nahIn hai. use jAnanekA prayojan hai. svayam apanemen sthir ho to svAnubhUti pragaT hotI hai.

jo vibhAv hai, shubhabhAv Unche-se UnchA ho to bhI apanA svarUp nahIn hai. usase svayamko bhinna karatA hai. lekin ise to vah jAnatA hai ki yah paryAy ek ansh hai, ye guN hain ve svayam ek-ek bhed hai, use jAn letA hai. chaitanya par akhaNDa dRuShTi kare, sAmAnya par dRuShTi kare. usamen jo visheSh paryAy hai vah pragaT hotI hai. usamen darshan, gnAn aur chAritra usamen sarva guNAnsh so samyagdarshan, sarva guNake ansh pragaT hote hain. aur usamen visheSh lInatA ho, lInatA hone-se munidashA Aye. antarmuhUrta-antarmuhUrtamen svarUpamen svayam nirvikalpa dashAmen bArambAr jamatA hai, usamen-se vItarAg dashA hotI hai. un sabamen bhinna-bhinna prakAr-se aTakanekI AvashyakatA nahIn hai. usakA prayojanabhUt jAn le, phir svayam apanI nishank pratIti-se lInatA karake Age baDhe to usamen-se use samyagdarshan (hotA hai). samyagdarshanake binA to kuchh hotA nahIn. Age baDhakar lInatA aur vItarAg dashA usImen pragaT hotI hai.

mumukShu- bahut sundar bAt Apane kahI. ek to aisA kahA ki rAg-se bhinnatA (karanI hai). bhedagnAn rAg-se karanekA hai. dravya-guN aur paryAyake bhedako jAnakar avalamban gnAyakakA karane-se bhedakA sahaj gnAn rah jAyagA, usamen aTakanA nahIn hai.

samAdhAna- usamen aTakanA nahIn hai. usakA bhedagnAn nahIn karanekA hai. usakA

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gnAn, usakA lakShaN pahachAnakar (ki) vah ansh hai, main anshI hUn. vah ansh chaitanyake ansh hain. usakA gnAn karake svayam apanemen dRuShTiko sthApit karake usamen lInatA karanekA prayojan hai.

mumukShu- bhedagnAn arthAt vibhAv-se bArambAr bhinna karanA.

samAdhAna- vibhAv-se bhinna karanA vah bhedagnAn hai.

mumukShu- pragnAchhain usI par paTakanI hai na? vibhAv aur chaitanyake bIcha.

samAdhAna- chaitanya aur vibhAvake bIch pragnAchhainI (paTakanI nahIn hai).

mumukShu- guN aur dravyake bIch nahIn paTakanI hai.

samAdhAna- guNake bIch pragnAchhainI nahIn paTakanI hai.

mumukShu- paryAy aur dravyake bIch..

samAdhAna- usamen pragnAchhainI nahIn hai.

mumukShu- gnAn karanA.

samAdhAna- usakA to gnAn karanekA hai.

mumukShu- paryAy kShaNik hai, dravya dhruv trikAl hai aisA gnAn karanA.

samAdhAna- gnAn karanA. paryAy pragaT hotI hai, ansh-anshamen pariNamati hai. AtmAmen ananta guN hain. sabakA gnAn karanA. usase bhedagnAn nahIn karanA hai.

mumukShu- sab nayA lagatA hai.

mumukShu- satya hai. jaisA kahanA ho vaisA kaho.

mumukShu- param satya. parantu is tarah guN-paryAy... bhedagnAn to rAg-se karanA hai.

mumukShu- vibhAv yAnI usamen rAg aur indriy gnAn donon le sakate hain?

samAdhAna- indriy gnAn arthAt usamen rAgamishrit gnAn A gayA. rAgamishrit gnAna. gnAnaguN apanA svabhAv hai. adhUrA gnAn hai vah rAgamishrit hai. vah usamen A jAtA hai. usamen gnAnakA bhAg is or lo to is or A jAtA hai, rAgakA bhAg use chalA jAtA hai. gnAnakA bhAg chaitanyakI or A jAtA hai, rAgakA bhAg vibhAv or chalA jAtA hai.

mumukShu- is or, us oramen kuchh...

samAdhAna- gnAnakA bhAg chaitanya taraph A jAtA hai. rAgakA bhAg vibhAv taraph jAtA hai, par taraph jAtA hai. rAgakA bhAg par taraph jAtA hai, gnAnakA bhAg sva taraph A jAtA hai. usamen apUrNa yA pUrNakA lakShya nahIn rakhakar, main gnAyak hI hUn. vaise gnAn so gnAn hI hai aur vibhAv so vibhAv hI hai. par taraph vibhAvakA bhAg jAtA hai.

mumukShu- rAgamishritamen vAstavamen rAgapanA hai usase bhinna paDanA hai. gnAn to mUl

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to svabhAvakA ansh hai.

samAdhAna- gnAn to svabhAvakA ansh hai.

mumukShu- ye to gnAn-se bhI bhinna karatA hai. bhUl hamArI aisI hotI hai. gnAn- se bhinna gnAyaka.

samAdhAna- apUrNa gnAn jitanA main nahIn hUn. pUrNa shAshvat hUn. ye kShayopasham gnAn, mati-shrut paryAy, avadhignAn, manaparyayagnAn Adi jo bhed paDate hain, vah bhed jo apUrNa paDate hain vah merA pUrNa svabhAv nahIn hai. pUrNako grahaN karanA, apUrNako grahaN nahIn karanA. jisamen rAgake kAraN, nimittake kAraN apUrNa paryAy hai, use grahaN nahIn karake svayamkA pUrNa svarUp, jise svayamkA chaitanyakA svarUp grahaN karanA hai, use pUrNa svarUp grahaN karanA chAhiye. apUrNa grahaN kare to bhI pUrNa svarUp grahaN nahIn kiyA hai. isaliye pUrNa svarUp grahaN karanA. phir ye sab to apUrNa paryAyen hain. kevalagnAn hotA hai vah pUrNa paryAy hai. parantu paryAy hai, aisA usakA gnAn karanA. paryAy hai, lekin vah chaitanyakI sAdhanAmen pragaT hotI paryAy hai, usakA gnAn karanA. parantu hai paryAy, usakA gnAn karanA. usase kahIn bhedagnAn nahIn karanA hai.

mumukShu- chaitanyakI sAdhanAmen pragaT hotI paryAyen hain.

samAdhAna- chaitanyakI sAdhanAmen pragaT hotI paryAy kevalagnAn hai.

mumukShu- phir bhI us apUrNakA Ashray nahIn karanA hai, Ashray to ekakA hI karanA hai.

samAdhAna- Ashray to pUrNakA karanA hai. Ashray anAdiananta dravyakA Ashray hai. Ashray karane-se usamen shuddha paryAyen pragaT hotI hain.

mumukShu- svabhAvakI hI mahimA. samAdhAna- svabhAvakI mahimA, pUrNakI mahimA. apUrNakI mahimA nahIn, pUrNa svabhAvakI mahimA.